RIP Cybertruck
Posted by voxadam 1 hour ago
Comments
Comment by brightball 41 minutes ago
The battery capacity on those things is equivalent to 9 Tesla Powerwall units or something close to it.
They may be ugly, but the emergency prepper in me always wanted one after hearing that story. Before, I always wanted to install powerwalls...but I never considered in an extended event being able to drive my powerwalls somewhere to recharge them.
Comment by thanhhaimai 13 minutes ago
I don't think the residential power generator is needed anymore if you have an electric car.
Comment by lrobinovitch 15 minutes ago
https://www.tesla.com/powershare/#vehicles
> Powershare allows you to draw power directly from your compatible Tesla vehicle to power your devices, your home or the grid.
> Powershare is currently available for all Cybertruck vehicles, and all new Model 3 and Model Y2 vehicles ordered on October 1, 2026 or later.
> To verify if your vehicle has Powershare, navigate to ‘Software’ > ‘Additional Vehicle Info’ > ‘Powershare Support: Enabled’ on your vehicle touchscreen.
Comment by maerF0x0 33 minutes ago
Comment by victorbojica 18 minutes ago
Comment by paxy 9 minutes ago
An $80K-100K car that replaces the two isn't some genius purchase.
Sure you can spend all the money you want on a luxury toy, nothing wrong with it, but it's weird trying to justify it as anything but that.
Comment by 80fj0348i 3 minutes ago
Comment by trial3 15 minutes ago
Comment by slowin 12 minutes ago
Comment by kube-system 26 minutes ago
Comment by kendkwncowncn 11 minutes ago
Comment by alt227 12 minutes ago
Comment by dragontamer 5 minutes ago
Cybertruck was announced first. Then Ford _released_ the F150 Lightning, including the ability to operate as a backup battery for a house. And a dozen or so months later, Cybertruck comes out at a much higher price than F150 Lightning ever was.
Comment by jonhohle 29 minutes ago
It’s unclear to me how a vehicle battery can be 9-10x the size of a house battery, be used as a house battery, include an highway safe cabin, motors and wheels and only cost 4x what a single home battery costs. Oh, and at least Kia rates their battery warranty based on miles driven, so using it as a home battery does not impact any 10-year capacity guarantees.
AI tells me they are completely different though, so I must be missing something.
Comment by twoWhlsGud 6 minutes ago
Comment by horsawlarway 3 minutes ago
They want ~9k for a freaking 13.5kwh pack.
I can buy a UL certified, 16kwh, outdoor rated pack for 3.5k (ex - EG4 allweather)
I can buy just the LFP batteries themselves for the new powerwall 3 LFP version (no BMS, no shell, no certification) for $1116... https://18650battery.com/products/byd-302ah-3-2v-lifepo4-pri...
Powerwall is a scammy product. WAY too expensive for the storage it provides.
---
So the summary is: Cybertruck is using a different battery chemistry, Powerwall is a scam.
(I mean - to be clear, the Cybertruck is also a scam, but it's a different kind of scam not directly related to the battery capacity, since it's hauling around a 123kWh NCMA battery pack)
Comment by TheSockStealer 39 minutes ago
Comment by TheSockStealer 36 minutes ago
Comment by annoyingnoob 32 minutes ago
Comment by SoftTalker 34 minutes ago
Comment by zippyman55 8 minutes ago
Comment by skizm 34 minutes ago
Comment by largbae 28 minutes ago
There is a model of Ford Lightning that has power sharing and now that resale values are way down it just might be a cost effective home battery that you can drive around during non-emergencies....
Comment by doctoboggan 20 minutes ago
Comment by alistairSH 28 minutes ago
You also need to have the house setup to run off a generator. You don't want the truck power feeding back into the grid. IIRC, that's usually done with a big switch near the main panel.
Comment by 27183 26 minutes ago
Comment by chasd00 2 minutes ago
Comment by mrj 17 minutes ago
I just bought a kit to convert to natural gas though. Most people who've done it are happy to not change bottles all the time. It won't help after an earthquake but the regular PSPS outages I get make natural gas a better fit for the moment.
Comment by iamnothere 1 minute ago
Comment by alt227 7 minutes ago
Comment by Scene_Cast2 23 minutes ago
Comment by jmull 12 minutes ago
The quiter part makes sense, but there are a lot more practical solutions to that too.
Comment by bob1029 16 minutes ago
If you are concerned about riding through a 14 day+ event you need a generator. Even a fully off-grid solar / wind setup could be compromised in these kinds of storms. I've seen entire roofs cleaned off by a <100mph storm. Anything not bolted down to a concrete slab cannot be depended on.
Comment by nashashmi 13 minutes ago
Comment by conductr 4 minutes ago
However, it provided content and distraction and kept the stock high longer than it should have and I feel like that’s what Musk continues to excel at.
Comment by dmix 1 minute ago
Comment by tyoma 48 minutes ago
They are going to be very valued collectors items in 30 years once the kids of today have enough disposable income to buy whichever are left roadworthy by then.
Comment by coloneltcb 38 minutes ago
Comment by ivanjermakov 21 minutes ago
Comment by Grombobulous 15 minutes ago
Let’s keep in mind that Tesla invested in this truck to be the next F-150, which is the best-selling vehicle in the USA for the past multiple decades.
Comment by next_xibalba 15 minutes ago
Comment by komali2 2 minutes ago
This is interesting to say given that by most objective measures of what constitutes a good truck, the cybertruck is a bad truck.
Comment by slowin 10 minutes ago
Comment by alt227 5 minutes ago
Comment by pfannkuchen 5 minutes ago
Comment by dilap 32 minutes ago
Mostly I've seen younger kids love it. I was at the park and a little girl saw a Cybertruck pull up -- "Look, Dad, it's from the future!"
I think Cybertruck is probably ultimately a failure, but the amount of hate it gets when they are at least trying to push things outside of the normal makes me sad. The amount of negativity towards anything new that's not perfect is insane.
Comment by wahnfrieden 25 minutes ago
Comment by latexr 15 minutes ago
A significant portion of the hate they get is for what they represent and who they’re from, not because they’re “new” or “different” or “not perfect”.
Comment by rdiddly 5 minutes ago
Comment by qwerpy 8 minutes ago
Comment by kaldev 4 minutes ago
Comment by TheBlight 33 minutes ago
Comment by PorciiVorbesc 30 minutes ago
Because adults around them groomed them for those actions. Kids don't just start booing at objects out of the blue, they parrot the learned behavior of the adults around them.
Comment by andrewjf 28 minutes ago
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Comment by MOARDONGZPLZ 34 minutes ago
Comment by burnerRhodov3 17 minutes ago
Create hundreds of thousands of jobs, paid the most tax of anyone in history by a large margin, and provided hope for America? Where would we be without spaceX launches? Still reliant on foreign adversaries to access space?
Comment by Matl 9 minutes ago
Otherwise you're of course right.
Comment by next_xibalba 13 minutes ago
What criminal charges, specifically, do you think he could and should be tried on?
Comment by jms703 8 minutes ago
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Comment by afavour 9 minutes ago
The Cybertruck does not have that quality.
Comment by fwip 1 minute ago
Comment by slowin 8 minutes ago
Comment by hexagonsun 45 minutes ago
Comment by richwater 39 minutes ago
Comment by orbital-decay 29 minutes ago
Comment by lettergram 24 minutes ago
The classroom of kids Ive seen (my kids attend 3 different schools), all of them are amazed by them - age ranges: 3, 7, 9 all their classrooms loved them. Same with some of the older kids I've been around. They're all boys, I do imagine it's a very boy-friendly car.
I personally don't have a cyber truck, not big on it personally, but never put my own opinions into my kids. The kids may not "like it", but they are amazed by it.
I'm in an area that doesn't really hate Musk, so I think that does have an impact.
Comment by mahboi 22 minutes ago
Comment by wahnfrieden 24 minutes ago
Comment by afavour 2 minutes ago
(FWIW my kids giggle at a Cybertruck and say it looks silly. I’m not convinced they’ll long for one in years to come)
Comment by eqmvii 1 minute ago
Comment by dgacmu 46 minutes ago
Comment by trollbridge 46 minutes ago
Comment by CharlieDigital 41 minutes ago
Both think it looks ugly.
No need to influence most people, IMO. Vehicles are shaped the way they are because the designs have broad appeal in general (familiarity? proportions? trends?). Most of us would find a normal, well-tailored black suit to be appealing and be baffled by avant garde, high fasion men's clothing.
Why should anyone be surprised that a completely novel design isn't appealing to most?
Comment by throwup238 17 minutes ago
Isn’t it mostly fuel efficiency standards and manufacturability? You’ve got a chassis that’s used for like five different models for five years between refreshes, not a lot of room to innovate without driving up all the costs so only the luxury cars can afford to look different.
Comment by CharlieDigital 10 minutes ago
Comment by faefox 45 minutes ago
Comment by seizethecheese 40 minutes ago
My kids are too young for this, but surely there's a tradeoff here. Should you override some of your child's natural wonder because of adult aesthetics (or worse political concerns)? Yes. But how often? I'm not sure the line should be drawn at a truck design. (Although, maybe you're teaching your kid taste, again I'm not sure.)
Comment by faefox 33 minutes ago
Comment by gchamonlive 43 minutes ago
Comment by fleroviumna 42 minutes ago
Comment by dgacmu 22 minutes ago
14yo probably influenced -me- more than the other direction, though. That one has strong opinions.
This is the same 14yo who when she was younger would delightedly point out every Tesla (then, mostly model S's) she saw on the road. Probably still responding to both aesthetics and politics but it was interesting to see the shift.
Comment by WillowWithAWand 42 minutes ago
Every parent influences their children. It's called parenting.
Comment by stephencanon 36 minutes ago
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Comment by llm_nerd 9 minutes ago
Do you have anything empirical to back this up? This feels like someone kind of hoping something is true. It's like the Harley rider sure that everyone thinks they're super cool with their super loud bike.
Comment by slowin 11 minutes ago
Comment by SCdF 40 minutes ago
Comment by RobotToaster 33 minutes ago
Comment by ReptileMan 25 minutes ago
Comment by Balgair 12 minutes ago
The cybertruck had good enough safety ratings, but kinda just decided to not care about the aerodynamics and economy side. Which freed Elon up a lot in terms of style.
Personally, I also agree that it was refreshing to see something bold out there on the road. It's just that the final product looked just 'off' enough to make it look bad in the end.
Like, it's wheel base is about 6 inches too long and the ride height is about 6 inches too low, making it look a bit toddler-y to my eyes. The bed was also just not practicable and too small (something I see on a lot of trucks these days). The speed was good, the torque was great, the giant screen you can't feel when driving was not. The seats were uncomfortable for my build.
Overall, the car was a statement, one that just barely missed the mark to my eyes, but it did miss
Comment by Esophagus4 6 minutes ago
That’s a platform we can all get behind.
Comment by gnarcoregrizz 24 minutes ago
It probably would have been better had they not been mass produced, and maybe did a very limited quantity run - make it more like a collector item... I suppose thats what it'll be now. I see quite a few on the road, it takes away from the uniqueness.
Comment by monegator 18 minutes ago
thank god these monstruosities were forbidden in europe
Comment by maxdo 24 minutes ago
48 volts, steering wheel, no paint ( better durability), trunk, wipers etc. the car pushed the boundaries. If you compare level of creative thinking of cybertruck vs lets say electric ford, it's not even comparable. I respect that despite one person behind it. I don't care how it looks. It's polarizing. oh well.
My 11 y.o. relative from abroad asked me to take rl pictures of the truck, after he heard my neighbor bought it.
Comment by classictraffic 13 minutes ago
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Comment by SoftTalker 28 minutes ago
Comment by lyelibi 14 minutes ago
Comment by yummypaint 38 minutes ago
If we can get some affordable electric trucks in the US, it will be very interesting to see how the more rational segments of the market react once they are no longer priced out.
Comment by anticorporate 35 minutes ago
I'm a current truck driver and very excited to swap out my ICE truck for a Slate next year. I need something that can haul my trash to the dump, grab a load of wood chips for the garden, and bring home the occasional sheet good from the home store.
I agree with your assessment as it applies to the Cybertruck or F150, but not the idea of an electric truck. Some people buy trucks because they need a light-duty hauling solution; unfortunately, the market seems to only want to sell luxury SUVs that happen to have truck beds.
Comment by bryanlarsen 33 minutes ago
Work trucks are a very different market than for passenger vehicles. Their usage is a lot more consistent and known. This means that electric works very well for some work trucks and very poorly for others.
The other aspect of work trucks is that they're generally purchased by very conservative businesses who don't want to buy the bleeding edge, they want several years of reliability data before committing. The F-150 Lightning was cancelled just as that data was starting to come in.
Of course, most F-150's are sold as passenger vehicles rather than work trucks. Along with almost all Cybertrucks.
Comment by crsv 37 minutes ago
Comment by maerF0x0 28 minutes ago
1. People who need to haul stuff in the bed
2. People who need to tow stuff behind them
3. People who buy them for some form of self expression.
Electrics are probably fine for people in 1 & 3. But for 2 I have yet to find one that both tows and gets range.
Comment by eitally 21 minutes ago
1. People who need them for work. 2. People who need to carry bulky loads 3. People who need to tow. 4. People who buy them for some form of self-expression.
The only real use case for electric trucks, imho, is construction site supervisors who do most around-town driving but may occasionally need to haul stuff. Their towing range is absolutely abysmal (F150 Lightning range dropped to about 90 miles when towing a moderate trailer!).
Comment by dilap 30 minutes ago
Comment by mingus88 39 minutes ago
I live in the PNW and you see people not using their trucks as trucks every single time you go out on the road. This includes urban areas.
I’ve owned an F150 and an R1T and for camping, overlanding, snow trips, etc the Rivian is hands down the most capable vehicle I have ever driven. You couldn’t pay me to go back to a Ford
Comment by snypher 33 minutes ago
Comment by alt227 3 minutes ago
Comment by trollbridge 45 minutes ago
It just looks too weird.
Comment by bluGill 39 minutes ago
It doesn't help that nearly all chargers are arranged such that I'd block important parts of the parking lot for half an hour if I was towing when I needed a charge, then I have a complex back out (where something is behind me that I need to avoid). Most gas stations are designed so my trailer might block a pump from someone else using it but otherwise I'm not in the way.
Comment by mingus88 30 minutes ago
The only actual difference is time you need to charge. Pull through charging stalls are ubiquitous where I live
And I just don’t know…how often are people towing loads over 100 miles regularly for this to be a problem? Where I live I see pavement princesses towing the occasional boat or landscapers towing gear and rocks.
Neither of those is going to max out the range on an EV truck in an average day
Comment by nozzlegear 40 minutes ago
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Comment by seizethecheese 38 minutes ago
Comment by richwater 38 minutes ago
The quality of the vehicle is actually quite high.
Comment by ballsac 21 minutes ago
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Comment by mahboi 17 minutes ago
Comment by alt227 29 minutes ago
Comment by adventured 18 minutes ago
Frankly Tesla is dumb lucky the Europeans and Japanese have botched the EV market so badly overall. Tesla shouldn't even exist at this point with how trivial their lineup is.
Comment by alt227 14 minutes ago
Comment by ribaspatel 45 minutes ago
The size is just too impractical. It would never fit in my garage. On top of that, the standby drain was significant. Just sitting idle, it would lose 10 to 20 miles of range.
Comment by firasd 53 minutes ago
DeLorean is the real life 80s reference of course, but in cyberpunk revival media like the coupe in Ghost in the Shell 2017, the spinner in Blade Runner 2049—those cars are all much smaller cabins than the cybertruck
Comment by aidenn0 17 minutes ago
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Comment by j45 5 minutes ago
Who would think we could get satellite internet that works?
Comment by _fat_santa 32 minutes ago
There's nothing quite like the Cybertruck and I don't think there ever will be again.
Comment by faefox 48 minutes ago
Comment by Kapura 54 minutes ago
Comment by barbecue_sauce 16 minutes ago
I would say the issue is more that there has been little to no progress in mainstream consumer car aesthetics in the past 25 years. It used to be that you could clearly tell a 50s car from a 60s car from a 70s car from an 80s car, etc. Everything from the past 25 years or so is pretty indistinguishable, so something comes along with a clear but possibly misguided aesthetic vision, its naturally going to appeal to some people.
Comment by trollbridge 43 minutes ago
The steel chassis provides rigidity instead of a traditional frame. They ended up having to be flat, not curved, to meet the design goal.
I guess we all just want something that “looks like a pickup”, is heavy, and guzzles $7 a gallon diesel fuel
Comment by Kapura 39 minutes ago
Comment by thrwfjauci2aa 11 minutes ago
Comment by mingus88 25 minutes ago
No actually the lightning and the R1T are pretty well loved by the people who took a chance on them
Comment by hn_submit 7 minutes ago
Tesla could simply come up with a more prevalent looking EV pick-up truck of course.
Comment by schiffern 1 hour ago
>blaming the problem on the wrong type of glue, a new adhesive “not prone to environmental embrittlement.”
That quote was about the new glue, not the old glue? >some RWD Cybertruck owners merrily driving along could be disconcertingly overtaken by their own wheels.
If they read their own link, that never happened?Who's doing the proofreading at Wired now? Is it all just AI?
Comment by CharlieDigital 54 minutes ago
> If they read their own link, that never happened?
https://www.foxbusiness.com/lifestyle/tesla-recalls-cybertru... > The issue stems from the brake rotors, and the report says more severe road conditions "may strain" the stud holes in the wheel rotor, causing cracks to form. If the cracks persist and worsen, it may result in the wheel detaching entirely.
https://autos.yahoo.com/ev-and-future-tech/articles/tesla-cy... > In a recent off-road escapade at the King of the Hammers event in Johnson Valley, California, a Tesla Cybertruck experienced a mechanical failure resulting in one of its wheels snapping off. The incident, captured over the weekend, has raised eyebrows about the durability of Tesla's much-touted electric truck.
I can't remember the specific video, but I recall seeing someone breakdown some of the poor materials/engineering choices for "truck" use cases and of the mass of the CT.Comment by schiffern 37 minutes ago
>off-road incident
So, big nothingburger.Obviously the NHTSA ('Highway' is right in the name) doesn't care if you boulder-crawl and break your car. That's easy to do, in any car!
Boulder crawling typically involves heavily modified vehicles for a reason.
Comment by CharlieDigital 35 minutes ago
> If the cracks persist and worsen, it may result in the wheel detaching entirely.
>
> ...engineers determined that continued use under strain could eventually lead to separation of the wheel stud from the hub.
Watch the YT video.Telsa made bad engineering choices on this vehicle. There's no point defending it.
Is it because your world view fractures with a fallible Musk?
Comment by gyanchawdhary 24 minutes ago
Comment by gyanchawdhary 52 minutes ago
Comment by dgacmu 26 minutes ago
As someone who described himself in an earlier post as a "Big Elon fan boy", perhaps the source of bias here lies in a location other than the author of the WIRED article.
Comment by i_love_retros 1 minute ago
Comment by jrauser 34 minutes ago
The poor people that bought them were the butt of his joke.
Comment by paularmstrong 32 minutes ago
Comment by SoftTalker 23 minutes ago
Later cars from Tesla looked more generic but still like looked like regular cars.
The cybertruck seems like a throwback to the old electric cars that looked like something out of nerd's sketchbook.
Comment by win311fwg 30 minutes ago
Comment by mingus88 23 minutes ago
Rivian selling the first EV pickup truck even after Elon’s announcement of the cybertruck is pretty embarrassing
Comment by hbarka 35 minutes ago
(Edit: the actual designer had the assistant designer throw a ball through the window.)
Comment by Quitschquat 23 minutes ago
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Comment by method_capital 48 minutes ago
I notice this internet world we live in, networked behind screens, really demonstrates the average person's drift to totalitarianism. It's frightening to me.
Comment by hbn 38 minutes ago
Comment by trollbridge 42 minutes ago
The answer was wait a long time since they’re sold out. Obviously someone wants them.
Comment by paularmstrong 31 minutes ago
Comment by kstrauser 23 minutes ago
With numbers that small, any vagary of demand can lead to lots full of unsold vehicles or waiting lists.
Comment by Kapura 59 minutes ago
hilarious sentiment
Comment by 1970-01-01 55 minutes ago
Comment by hbn 27 minutes ago
Comment by Grombobulous 6 minutes ago
I’m sure there are passionate people over at the Mitsubishi mirage owners club as well.
We can’t blame political reasons for the Cybetruck failing, especially in the context of the Model Y and Y L selling like hotcakes.
No, the problem with the Cybertruck is the styling is polarizing in person, it came in overpriced and under-ranged, and it wasn’t built for a buyer demographic that exists in large numbers.
Slate understands truck buyer motivation and demographics a lot better than Tesla. Chevrolet with the Silverado EV understands much better what their buyer demographic for an EV truck needs to succeed (be a regular half-ton truck, get as much range while towing as possible). And those companies are still likely to struggle or are struggling to sell EV trucks, respectively.
If Tesla knew what they were doing they’d have made a true full-size 3 row SUV similar to the EV9, and they’d also make a city car for Europe. But they blew development money on a bespoke single-country truck.
Comment by howunfortunate 53 minutes ago
It's certainly more balanced than a forum of non-owners who's only knowledge about the issue is that they hate Elon with an undying passion.
Comment by jjuel 45 minutes ago
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Comment by ramesh31 48 minutes ago
He wishes. Delorean is a modern classic, regardless of commercial success. Cybertruck will go down like the H1/H2; something entirely emblematic of the worst excesses in the time it was conceived and marketed in, that later generations will go "did they really think that was cool?".
Comment by linksnapzz 27 minutes ago
Setting aside JohnZ's personal failings, the car and its production was a catastrophe.
Comment by mingus88 13 minutes ago
Comment by hypfer 40 minutes ago
Renault is designing cute things again, so that's a good development. So is Citroen, apparently?
So that's a good development
Comment by nazgulsenpai 58 minutes ago
Comment by bredren 32 minutes ago
Doesn’t the new ~flying car have similar design vibes?
Comment by mrob 55 minutes ago
Comment by whynotmaybe 52 minutes ago
Comment by trollbridge 41 minutes ago
I just find the moral grandstanding a bit off. The vehicle industry isn’t exactly a paragon of executive virtue
Comment by whynotmaybe 17 minutes ago
I don't know what the others think so I can't judge on that, but I can judge based of what Elon says and does.
And aside, Elon's been lying for years about everything and promising stuff Tesla can't deliver.
IMHO, there's a strong parallel between the Elisabeth Holmes/Theranos situation and Elon/Tesla.
Comment by kstrauser 19 minutes ago
Comment by toyg 43 minutes ago
The Countach was just the usual Lamborghini luxury scam, and I say that as someone who grew up a few km from the factory. Nobody cared if it was kinda crap inside, because it existed just to look like a cool car. A truck is supposed to, y'know, be a truck.
Comment by giantrobot 46 minutes ago
Just because something is "angular" doesn't mean it's in any way comparable to a Cybertruck.
Comment by laughing_man 54 minutes ago
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Comment by iAMkenough 53 minutes ago
To those that downvoted, I’m sorry my opinion offended you.
Comment by linksnapzz 17 minutes ago
"If Kenmore had the wherewithal to manufacture 4wd electric chest freezers...that's what they'd look like."
...but I'm not offended by it. I think that sort of whimsical craziness is all too often missing from modern durable goods, so I'm glad it got built.
I'm even happier that its existence upset mincing, peevish little eurotwee Conde-Nasty scribblequeefs like this Wired author. If it'd guarantee him leaping off of a tall pier, I'd pay MSRP for a Cybertruck.
Comment by Zigurd 39 minutes ago
Comment by x3haloed 37 minutes ago
There were other things that contributed to the decision, too: the announced "stressed skin" exoskeleton was panned in favor of adhering the body panels to the body with glue, it became clear that Tesla's profit and valuation were funding Elon's right-wing political project, and I would have preferred a solid-axle design.
The absurdity was not what was wrong with it. It's OK to be absurd. I really liked the stainless steel design. Less trail damage when off-roading and no need to worry about paint scratches causing body rust. The door wedge design? Meh. But it enabled the stainless steel body.
In the end, I want what the Cybertruck failed to deliver: a full-size electric pickup at a good price with excellent range. I currently have my eyes on the RAM REV. We'll see if that one gets axed, too.
Comment by adventured 25 minutes ago
At present all Tesla has propping it up is bubble dust and one car model (one increasingly dated car model). Somehow after 14-15 years (Model S released in Summer 2012) these people still can't release a real SUV of any sort. The model Y is a grotesque joke of a fake SUV, a mutilated model 3 that doesn't really look like an SUV in any regard. The model Y is an SUV like the Cybertruck is a truck. They might as well have unlimited money to do it, and they can't do it. Same reason they couldn't release the roadster even after all this time. It's a fundamentally broken company because Musk won't get out of the way. Whatever Musk is good at it, it's not running a large scale automotive company.
Comment by robotresearcher 5 minutes ago