Raspberry Pi blocks changing RAM chips
Posted by edandersen 1 hour ago
Comments
Comment by Aurornis 52 minutes ago
Comment by Tepix 18 minutes ago
Drawback: You need different silkscreens for different amounts of RAM.
Btw, if you're worried about RAM-swapped units you can already verify them as described at https://geekworm.com/blogs/news/prevent-ram-swapped-raspberr...
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(§) as can be seen here https://pip-assets.raspberrypi.com/categories/1129-pcn/docum...
Comment by frenchtoast8 8 minutes ago
Comment by DoctorOetker 44 minutes ago
Comment by Aurornis 42 minutes ago
Comment by DoctorOetker 22 minutes ago
in those jurisdictions where either price discrimination or locking hardware are not illegal, it is typically perfectly legal to reverse engineer for compatibility purposes. So nothing prevents such resellers from upping their game and learning a thing or two about link training and general SDRAM bringup.
Once they have acquired the knowledge legally in such jurisdictions the product just flows in the other jurisdictions anyway.
Courts upheld the monopolistic position of microsoft etc. for decades, but respect has no finality, "re" + "spect" to review, so later such companies were fined for their decades long transgressions.
But during those decades it may appear legal to the average consumer.
Inaction is not permission.
Comment by Grombobulous 13 minutes ago
Reverse engineering is legal, but manufacturers don’t have to help you figure out how to reverse engineer their products and they’re allowed to design their products in a way that makes it difficult.
There’s generally not a lot of jurisdictions out there that make stuff like hardware lockdowns of this nature illegal, especially for companies that are not in regulated industries or are not monopoly/oligopoly players.
Comment by smilespray 35 minutes ago
Comment by Aurornis 24 minutes ago
Comment by smilespray 10 minutes ago
Comment by iso1631 34 seconds ago
Comment by kmeisthax 24 minutes ago
Doing a RAM swap and then selling the resulting unit as if it were a Raspberry Pi of the higher RAM capacity might be construed as trademark infringement[0]. And in general it's fairly difficult to make arguments in antitrust cases that boil down to "yes, your honor, everything they're doing is within their rights but I don't like it".
[0] At the same time, the scammers could probably get away with this by putting "Upgraded to 16GB!" in the title of their eBay listings or whatever, in the same way that fraudulent storage devices are labeled as "upgraded" (read: lying about their capacity). That doesn't impact the antitrust analysis though.
Comment by DoctorOetker 20 minutes ago
But if this is the real concern, they could just display the fact that "Unoriginal RAM detected" to inform the user its not a vanilla RPi Foundation product, so buyers understand the situation, but continue booting normally.
Comment by jamesh98 25 minutes ago
Comment by kotaKat 26 minutes ago
https://github.com/therealdreg/ftdibrick
Pepperidge Farm remembers the FTDI driver bricking.
Comment by undersuit 23 minutes ago
Comment by kotaKat 15 minutes ago
If someone gets updated in the wild (like this person did without realizing they had a counterfeit board), they'll fail to boot.
Comment by squeegeeninja 51 minutes ago
Comment by Wowfunhappy 7 minutes ago
You can already check whether the RAM has been swapped via https://geekworm.com/blogs/news/prevent-ram-swapped-raspberr....
Comment by zamadatix 36 minutes ago
Comment by locknitpicker 39 minutes ago
What fraud are you speaking of?
Comment by Grombobulous 9 minutes ago
If it’s represented as a new product or offered with manufacturer’s warranty, that would cross into fraud.
Comment by alibarber 31 minutes ago
Comment by horsawlarway 4 minutes ago
1: I think people should be able to replace chips on an RPi as they desire, so I don't love that they're actively preventing this
2: As a buyer, I absolutely want to know if I'm buying an RPi that has had chips replaced
3: A shady seller changing the SKU to mimic a better board after changing chips is just flat out fraud.
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It's the classic "Mattress tag" case - it should be illegal to remove as a seller, and fine as the final customer.
But that's really hard to functionally enforce.
Comment by petu 33 minutes ago
Comment by jamesh98 27 minutes ago
Comment by juancn 40 minutes ago
Comment by speedping 33 minutes ago
Sad to see industry pioneers lose to players that copy them and undercut prices using cheap labor.
Comment by jamesh98 27 minutes ago
Comment by themgt 1 hour ago
Comment by BlackRabbit1 1 hour ago
AFAIR the EEPROM mostly uses the VideoCore instruction set.
Comment by ChrisArchitect 26 minutes ago
Comment by kmeisthax 32 minutes ago
Practically speaking, though, this antifeature doesn't affect most people, because I don't think most people are willing to take a heat gun to a microsoldered part just to save a few bucks on RAM. If the RAM was socketed somehow - which at this scale and performance tier is not possible - then I'd probably be way angrier.
Comment by dofm 28 minutes ago
Comment by VCFundedGenYer 38 minutes ago
Comment by dave78 35 minutes ago
I don't think that's been true for a long time. Their main market is commercial users now - reference what happened with COVID shortages and RPi prioritizing nearly all of their capacity to commercial users, leaving tinkerers with little to no stock.
Comment by mschuster91 25 minutes ago
Way to read the room, jfc. Hardbricking hardware is not the answer, see FTDI.
I get why they are doing that... but I think there should be a way for users to flash a separate firmware, maybe tied to the hardware key similar to the old h264/mpeg license, that allows the usage of a modified board.
PS: Arrest Sam Altman who caused all of this mess in the first place with his market manipulation stunt.
Comment by dannyw 1 hour ago
Comment by sbarre 59 minutes ago
As they clearly explained, giving you the choice to swap the RAM chips would create broader systemic problems that would lead to bad customer experiences and a support burden for their organization.
You'd be ok with that trade?
Local maximalists like to imagine a world where everything is aligned with their own personal incentives, but then present this world as being filled with freedom and choices. Just not anyone else's freedom or choices, only their own.
Comment by choo-t 3 minutes ago
• etch the ram around on the board itself.
• provide a pre-RMA check so user can verify if their unit is genuine (serial number linked to ram amount)
• void warranty on resoldered board.
Comment by VCFundedGenYer 38 minutes ago
So no, it's not reasonable at all.
Buy an Apple product if you want what you're stating.
Comment by camgunz 30 minutes ago
Comment by dingaling 27 minutes ago
Umm, yes...?
Just put a 'warranty void when removed' frangible sticker on it. Seems to work fine for PCs.
But so many people these days seem to be brainwashed into accepting that computing devices should come with soldered RAM and locked bootloaders, they probably can't even envisage how hardware used to be. Yes, modding my device voided the warranty and I didn't care. Freedom has a cost.
Comment by camgunz 9 minutes ago
Comment by Isamu 53 minutes ago
Excellent comment, worth repeating, thanks
Comment by TheChaplain 1 hour ago
Yeah it's stupid, but people doesn't know better, they'll complain loudly Raspberry PI is sh* it doesn't work and the Pi Foundation are scammers.
I can understand why they don't want that.
Comment by pmontra 1 hour ago
I can't help thinking that they want to sell maxed out devices to max out margin.
Comment by alibarber 55 minutes ago
- 8GB Pi is out of stock / too expensive - due to RAM shortage
- Someone bought a load of non-8GB Pis
- Replaced the RAM with whatever they could get their hands on (cheap enough to be worth the hassle, cheap because no one else wants it even given the ongoing shortage - so probably pretty suspicious / of dubious quality)
- The end user buys it and has no idea it has been modified and the warranty is void
- RPi probably don't want to spend their time supporting it. Probably can't if the memory is a load of crap, even if they wanted to. It gets bricked.
The point here is someone bought something else (a fake pi) than they thought they were getting. Not that someone willingly wanted to go hacking.
Comment by dsr_ 57 minutes ago
Since, presumably, nobody would try to sell a board with less RAM on it than shipped, a count-down scheme instead of count-up would work.
16GB board: no holes drilled in a marked area; 8GB: one hole drilled; 4GB: two holes drilled; 2GB: three holes drilled.
Comment by Aurornis 51 minutes ago
Comment by throwaway85825 25 minutes ago
Comment by adolph 43 minutes ago
Comment by paleotrope 21 minutes ago
Comment by functionmouse 1 hour ago
Comment by Brian_K_White 57 minutes ago
There is always a reason someone does any bad thing. There is always obviously some advantage to the perpetrator.
The fact they are only reacting to some other bad actions doesn't excuse it because there are any number of ways to to react. This way is the one way they chose when they have infinity to choose from.
Comment by functionmouse 1 hour ago
Comment by oxcartctl 24 minutes ago
Comment by kingstnap 41 minutes ago
The 2026 financial report is apparently this Thursday on Sept 24. So will see how this played out for them. Their stock is all over the place anyway with low float.
Comment by bluGill 31 minutes ago
Even for pi, the real value is in industrial companies that don't want to hire their own maintainers.
Comment by mschuster91 21 minutes ago
Reminds me of Adobe's history to be honest. They also were big on hooking the young to their ecosystem, including turning more than one blind eye towards piracy, and once they had a captive userbase plus a lack of competition, they enshittified.
Comment by Palomides 17 minutes ago
Comment by liendolucas 31 minutes ago
Comment by dofm 24 minutes ago
(To be clear, I don't know either way; I'm just assuming that this was contemplated because it's easier)