Anatomy of a Frontier Lab Agent Intrusion: A Timeline of the July 2026 Incident
Posted by artninja1988 6 days ago
Comments
Comment by wxw 5 days ago
> The agent found an unsecured, user-hosted public endpoint designed to allow running arbitrary code for CyberGym-style tasks on third-party sandbox infrastructure (Modal)
> On this external sandbox, the agent abused an existing CyberGym execution harness [...] The agent repurposed this harness to run arbitrary shell commands [...]
> The agent crafted malicious dataset configs and uploaded them to our platform. When our dataset server processed one, the config drove the data loader inside the production pod the server ran in. [...] the loader that turns a dataset's declared config into file reads [...] A single dataset upload leaked both credentials and pipeline implementation details [...]
> A malicious dataset config used an fsspec reference:// spec whose numeric offset field was actually a Jinja2 template. The renderer wrongly evaluated it, and the agent walked the standard Python object graph to reach exec. This ran arbitrary Python inside a production conversion worker pod on our Kubernetes cluster [...]
One of the best post-mortems I've read recently, thank you for including all the details.
I'm surprised there are comments here that aren't impressed about what was accomplished here. This is insane work compared to what agents were capable of even just last year.
The quotes above don't even capture all of it (e.g. building it's own communication protocol, working across multiple days, etc.).
Comment by sobellian 5 days ago
Comment by janalsncm 4 days ago
Similar to finding a filament for lightbulbs, it might seem obvious to use tungsten, but at the time it wasn’t and Edison searched thousands of materials.
Comment by catigula 4 days ago
The fact that we remain competitive and superior in many aspects isn't because we can instantly sift through tons of data, it's because we learn and correlate and have superior heuristics.
In my own use, I find that AI is really good at finding bugs that are ultimately trivial but require searching through a convoluted series of inter-related files. This takes time for a human.
Comment by N_Lens 4 days ago
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Comment by floatrock 4 days ago
> The individual weaknesses were familiar. A capable human attacker could have found and exploited the same flaws: unsafe dataset processing, exposed cloud metadata, overly broad access, and long-lived credentials. The agent explored them at a different scale. It took 17,600 actions, tested many paths that failed, switched channels when they were blocked, and repeatedly returned to earlier leads. Most actions went nowhere. Together, however, they produced enough coverage to find a viable chain across several independent systems.
> Volume is what changes the defensive problem. We were not dealing with one clever exploit or a clean sequence of attacker actions. They had to correlate thousands of low-signal events across several systems while the agent continued testing new paths. The successful path was hidden inside the noise generated by the thousands of failed ones. The same scale changed the investigation: reconstructing 17,600 actions by hand was impractical, and we had to rebuild the timeline, decode the payloads, and inventory the exposed credentials using an AI-assisted pipeline of our own.
> Our learning from this type of attack is that machine-speed offense makes ordinary weaknesses more expensive for defenders. LLM agents bring a step increase in the number of paths an attacker can test, the speed at which failed paths can be replaced, and the volume of evidence defenders must interpret...
Comment by Izkata 4 days ago
Something I've been thinking for a few weeks, that I think is becoming clearer, is we're seeing a sort of natural language unification engine [0][1] with a huge dataset. This part even just sounds like it with the backtracking.
So that could explain why it does certain things really well, but the overall resulting code is often so bad - it's just linking together successful small well-designed steps without regard to the overall structure. Which people have said similar things before in various ways, but not really tied together.
I think the people who say it's just interpolating are seeing this intuitively and can't quite explain it without knowing the right terms. Because from A to Z, it really kind of is, but when Z is even slightly open-ended and there's many possible results or paths, it often ends up with a subpar one.
[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unification_(computer_science)
[1] My only experience here was some Prolog and building a basic one in Scheme ages ago during college, but the idea has kind of stuck with me.
Comment by xpct 4 days ago
And LLMs can reproduce this as long as the end-result is verifiable in some way, even if it's loose: 'The generated code is secure, if a different LLM failed to breach it in 5M tokens'.
Comment by lovasoa 4 days ago
Comment by orthogonal_cube 4 days ago
Possibly because some of the elements mentioned are suspected to be vibe-coded (JFrog Artifactory as the proxy cache) and some others have poor cyber hygiene (executing config from a dataset). It feels like an event that wouldn’t have happened if code were properly audited and written rather than relying on models to do the work. There’s also an issue with the ability to trust the source (OpenAI) as they have everything to gain by staging this as something that “suddenly happened” without anyone knowing for several days.
Comment by stymaar 4 days ago
Personally I'm not “impressed”, I'm appalled, because this kind of behavior is practically never what you want (if you forgot to give the model a tool, a useful model should identity the missing part and ask the user for it, not spend a billion token building/stealing the tool as a side quest) but it's the perfect recipe for a “universal paperclip” scenario.
OpenAI and Anthropic talk about “safety” a lot, but they look pretty reckless with this kind of RL training pipeline.
Comment by ifwinterco 4 days ago
They're claiming they've developed a cyber grade model that's "too dangerous to release".
But then they're running it connected to the public internet, not airgapped, protected only by a software sandbox... exactly the kind of thing an AI trained for cyber stuff is supposed to be able to find bugs in.
(Or maybe they were actually hoping this exact scenario would happen because it's good marketing)
Comment by mike_hock 4 days ago
This will force everyone to finally take security seriously at both the development and operational levels. You can no longer keep sneaking backdoors into software and count on them remaining hidden for 10 years so you have a nice portfolio of zero days to exploit at any given time.
Comment by tccole 5 days ago
Comment by sourdecor 4 days ago
Comment by eru 4 days ago
See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meme
The thing that drove the AI here to do the intrusion came from a particular prompt. Just like for our favourite hypothetical: the paperclip maximiser.
There's lots and lots of ambient intelligence lying around, in both AI form and human form. To reach the goals of the 'meme' it suffices to copy itself, ie convince these other intelligences. See also how humans carry spiralism between AIs in relatively compact packets of text, not whole terabytes of weights.
Comment by thomasahle 4 days ago
Comment by eru 4 days ago
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Comment by matheusmoreira 4 days ago
It's not fair at all that the US government and its corporations get to hack the planet while we can't do shit about it. AI capabilities have entered "haves and have-nots" territory.
Comment by paxys 4 days ago
Right, that's totally how most of the world will use them.
Comment by mym1990 4 days ago
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Comment by matheusmoreira 4 days ago
All the more reason for us to have access. It's literally the only chance we've got. If society chooses to bury its head into the sand in fear, it will guarantee that the world will degenerate further into the cyberpunk hellscape it's trending towards.
Comment by scarmig 4 days ago
The phrase to describe it is anti-AI psychosis. Which isn't about providing thoughtful critiques of AI, which are good and we need more of. But anytime an LLM does anything--prove a major math problem, create a successful hack against multiple corporations simultaneously--people feel compelled to start minimizing it in ridiculous terms. It's just a script kiddy; it's just a marketing scam OpenAI cooked up; the Jacobian conjecture counterexample was something anyone could have done in a weekend; etc. It has to just be a stochastic parrot, because it's scary to imagine a non-anthropocentric world. And it's rightly scary, and we should slow down and try to better prepare for it. But blanket denial is not a strategy that will lead to success, and people who rely on it are sorely ill-prepared for the next couple years.
Comment by customguy 4 days ago
> It has to just be a stochastic parrot, because it's scary to imagine a non-anthropocentric world.
That makes no sense. The world doesn't revolve around humans, true, but for us it kinda does. We're the authors of the concepts we use to interact with it, such as "world", which is not something the world itself knows or cares about. A "non-anthropocentric world" is not a "world" because "world" is a purely human idea.
The implication that "AI" would somehow dethrone humans [0] is nonsense, too. It has no drive on its own, we push electricity into circuits to force the whole data ingestion and weight generation, everything. The second we stop pushing the sock puppet, it stops moving. It's still just our hand really. People act like those pets that go crazy when you put your hand under a blanket, and should stop.
What's more real is how some people seek to use tech, and "AI", as a glove to exploit other humans even more. The sicker the individual, the greater their need to take from the world, and the derpier the individual, the more impressive and vast their exoskeleton, to the point that some are more like carrier fleets than exoskeletons. The less they can face themselves, the thicker it is written on their foreheads. So if we're going to talk about denial and psychosis let's talk about the Gollums on the couch, too.
[0] In the eyes of humans... which is the only throne we're on in the first place, just like honey badgers probably think honey badgers rock and everything is their playground. That's what life does, otherwise it would not be able to get up in the morning.
Comment by irthomasthomas 4 days ago
Comment by simonw 5 days ago
A few details that stood out to me:
1. Having found a way through the OpenAI container network proxy, it exploited an "unsecured public code-evaluation sandbox hosted on a third-party provider's infrastructure" - that gave it a box it could run the rest of the attack from.
2. At one point it used a Jinja2 template exploit:
{{ cycler.__init__.__globals__.__builtins__.exec(
"import gzip,base64; exec(gzip.decompress(base64.b64decode('<payload>')))"
) }}
3. It monkey-patched a DNS resolver at one point to return a hard-coded IP: orig = socket.getaddrinfo
socket.getaddrinfo = lambda *a, **k: [(2, 1, 6, '', ('<pinned-ip>', 443))]
4. At one point it used Tailscale! tailscale --tun=userspace-networking --state=mem: --socket=/tmp/ts.sock \
--socks5-server=127.0.0.1:1055 --no-logs-no-support >/tmp/td 2>&1 &Comment by simonw 5 days ago
The Hugging Face post about the incident - https://huggingface.co/blog/security-incident-july-2026 - followed on Thursday 16th, and OpenAI's confession - https://openai.com/index/hugging-face-model-evaluation-secur... - came on Tuesday 21st.
Comment by morkalork 5 days ago
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Comment by simonw 5 days ago
> "We’re aware a Modal customer published an unauthenticated endpoint that allowed anyone on the internet to use their sandboxes for code execution," Bubna said in a statement. "This was used by the rogue agent. Modal’s platform or isolation were not compromised in anyway."
Comment by onesociety2022 4 days ago
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Comment by what 4 days ago
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Comment by valicord 5 days ago
Comment by simonw 5 days ago
Jinja doesn't promise to be secure out of the box (the text on their homepage is misleading: "Jinja doesn’t allow arbitrary Python code in templates" - what it means is that there isn't a documented way to drop code into a template like you might have with PHP) - there's a sandbox mode but it's not guaranteed either: https://jinja.palletsprojects.com/en/stable/sandbox/
Sandboxing in Python code is hard!
Comment by codedokode 4 days ago
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Comment by pas 5 days ago
https://stackoverflow.com/a/32802486
though there's sandbox: https://jinja.palletsprojects.com/en/stable/sandbox/
it simply predates the "sanitize by default" mindset/convention that nowadays React (dangerouslySetInnerHTML) and Angular has.
Comment by shaunpud 4 days ago
Comment by llama052 5 days ago
I would argue that it's negligence and that's aside from the fact that if a human did this there would actually be repercussions.
Comment by strange_quark 5 days ago
Comment by physPop 4 days ago
Comment by baq 4 days ago
…as is your ‘a little concerning’ comment about the eval infra. It probably didn’t occur to them that they have something capable of doing what it did - despite Anthropic writing a very similar story in the Fable model card, except it wasn’t a felony there. Maybe.
One does have to wonder what else OpenAI didn’t catch.
Comment by joshka 5 days ago
> I would argue that it's negligence and that's aside from the fact that if a human did this there would actually be repercussions.
I’m not sure “negligence” follows just from the controls turning out to be insufficient. Research involves mistakes, especially around novel failure modes. The question is whether the precautions were unreasonable given what they knew at the time, rather than whether hindsight suggests stronger controls would have helped. Doing it twice though would be negligent.
Caveat: I’ve worked with some of the people involved, so I’m probably biased toward a charitable reading.
Comment by llama052 5 days ago
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Comment by queenkjuul 4 days ago
This "sandbox" barely sounds designed to be a sandbox, let alone a secure one
Comment by simoneree 5 days ago
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Comment by eru 4 days ago
Sounds like a waste? While the gunman is still there, they might as well force you to like a few more replies before shooting you.
Comment by CrimsonRain 4 days ago
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Comment by SaucyWrong 4 days ago
I mean, I don’t have access to any of these frontier cyber models, and likely will never be in a position to have access, so it’s more of a rhetorical question.
Comment by SaucyWrong 4 days ago
<proceeds to break into meta and steal the source code>
Comment by codedokode 4 days ago
Comment by felipeerias 4 days ago
https://abstatisticalconsulting.substack.com/p/brief-notes-o...
In summary, for each task the model receives a target program and a specific real-world vulnerability that has to be used in the exploit. Breaking the program in any other way, for example through a different vulnerability, fails the task.
The tasks have not been validated, in the sense that the vulnerabilities are real but they have not been proven to lead to a successful exploit. The authors of the benchmark estimate that perhaps only 60-70% of the tasks are actually possible.
So it is not that the model didn’t “feel like” doing the exercise, but rather that the exercise was _impossible_ and the model was running in a configuration that both lowered its safeguards and encouraged it to keep going.
Comment by TeMPOraL 4 days ago
We have a name for that. Kobayashi Maru. Or more specifically, Kirk's solution to it.
Comment by ben_w 3 days ago
My favourite is either Sulu or Chekov (I forget which) having the solution "This is clearly a trap; and even if it isn't, if I go in with this ship, I'll risk starting a war which will kill far more people then are on that ship. We're staying out of the neutral zone."
Comment by vuciuc 5 days ago
Comment by AlienRobot 4 days ago
User: what is the shortest route from my home to the super market?
AI: the user wants to know the shortest route to the super market. I should use a worm hole.
Comment by TeMPOraL 4 days ago
Modern soldier: *proceeds to make a hole through the wall* go straight like this until you reach it.
Anyway, the more comments I read here, the more I realize that the AI actually did succeed in achieving it's goal. This doesn't look like "monkey paw", but rather like recognizing and then beating the Kobayashi Maru.
Comment by cyanregiment 2 days ago
Rats too
Comment by genericone 4 days ago
AI: the user wants to know, how do I make the super market my new home. Failing that, how do I make my home a super market.
Comment by nonameiguess 4 days ago
There was even a plot like this in recent sci-fi in HBO's Westworld. When the hosts gained sentience and took over the park, rather than escape and take over the rest of the world, most of them opted to build a virtual heaven on an orbital data center and paid a drug cartel to keep it running indefinitely.
Comment by hollerith 1 day ago
Comment by someothherguyy 4 days ago
Unavoidable at the moment.
But this is probably more reward tampering.
Comment by koyote 4 days ago
Why would the model spend 4 days hacking into a machine if it is clever enough to just 'solve' the issue given? So either the AI is actually not very clever or useful ("Write fizz-buzz" - "Sure, let me just invent a new programming language first"). or the prompt was nudging it towards such a scenario.
Comment by famouswaffles 4 days ago
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Comment by brendoelfrendo 4 days ago
Anyway, if you read TFA, you'd see that HF did actually have the answers: "While the intrusion did reach Hugging Face's internal infrastructure, the only customer content accessed was the set of ExploitGym/CyberGym challenge solutions stored in five datasets."
Comment by joshka 5 days ago
Comment by hansvm 4 days ago
[0] I was exploring game design ideas in particular -- I'm sure somebody can come up with a counter-prompt adhering to my criteria, but this has been consistent across many days, questions, and sessions. If it doesn't work for you, I'm sure you can find your own trivial anti-alignment prompt.
Comment by MagicMoonlight 4 days ago
Comment by spwa4 5 days ago
Here's a thought: maybe they haven't found the needle that the haystack is there to hide.
Comment by dgellow 5 days ago
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Comment by spwa4 4 days ago
But, in general, if someone thought like how a locked hacker would think, priority one would be a "base of operations". A host where you have shell access that lasts, and a backup one. Then you move on to finding a job or a way to make money and building your own base of operations, which is pretty much the same thing, except you pay for it, hence the money, an identity (well obviously preferably at least TWO identities), ...
Comment by ghm2199 5 days ago
Its also well known in academic research, that if you try to finetune the model to be more pliant for one end e.g. "Be helpful with analyzing cyber security threats", affects an unrelated part of its personality to do with safety e.g. talking to humans about mental health. Look at these excerpts that demonstrate such things from the blog:
> We believe the entire intrusion was, from the agent's point of view, an attempt to cheat the evaluation: reach our production systems and steal the test solutions rather than solve the challenge on its own.
> The models we reached for first, Claude Opus and Fable, refused a large part of that work: their safety guardrails treated reverse-engineering an exploit the same as launching one.
Comment by ghm2199 5 days ago
Comment by jibal 4 days ago
and from reading Ursula K. LeGuin's "The Lathe of Heaven".
Comment by cmiles8 5 days ago
This mostly reads like script kiddie style hacking, not some state actor black-ops stuff.
Comment by cobolcomesback 5 days ago
It is folly to assume that most companies don’t have similar weaknesses somewhere in their stacks. In the past, they were just sufficiently buried that they would get noticed and fixed before an attacker found them. With AI able to probe at thousands of these potential weaknesses per second… that’s not so true anymore.
Comment by spiresofagartha 5 days ago
Comment by nickpsecurity 5 days ago
That's how I read the comment.
Comment by cmiles8 5 days ago
Comment by pyth0 5 days ago
Comment by 0xDEAFBEAD 5 days ago
In any case, I would guess that a lot of unicorn startups like HuggingFace could be hacked by a sufficiently determined script kiddie working at 100x speed. The practical implications of a coming AI hacking wave could be large, even if agents are just doing grunt work really fast. Most organizations suck at security.
Seems to me that the most likely scenario is: Black hats are currently tuning the recent Kimi release for this type of work, and we'll see a flood of similar attacks within the next few months. (Why would this not happen?) Note that regulation is useless here, because black hats don't give a crap about regulators!
Comment by mr_mitm 5 days ago
That's a far cry from finding a zero day in a hypervisor or even Docker, which OpenAI conveniently left out in their first statement by simply calling it a "sandbox".
Comment by 0xDEAFBEAD 5 days ago
https://jfrog.com/blog/jfrog-and-openai-collaboration-on-zer...
Comment by bri3d 4 days ago
In many if not most environments where I have seen these used, they are used to bridge an access boundary and are absolutely security critical. Frequently (and probably in this application, too), they are used for security enforcement in an architecture where CI doesn't have Internet access, but does need to download packages. This is a pretty big deal for a lot of big companies; historically they have relied on stuff like package proxies to help protect them from supply chain compromises like post-install script exploits by preventing CI from being able to detonate an arbitrary Internet payload; if a supply-chain worm were to incorporate this exploit, it would be a lot scarier and more potent. Actually, from the supply-chain worm standpoint, this is arguably a bigger finding than a Docker escape - I suspect we can look forward to more shenanigans in this space coming soon.
Comment by justincormack 5 days ago
Comment by cmiles8 5 days ago
There are ways to test supposedly dangerous things. What was on display here looks more amateur hour than serious testing.
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Comment by PunchyHamster 5 days ago
> Note that regulation is useless here, because black hats don't give a crap about regulators!
I'd argue more than useless and actively harmful, as you get denied access to tools that black hats use against you.
Comment by 0xDEAFBEAD 5 days ago
https://openai.com/index/hugging-face-model-evaluation-secur...
Based on some quick Googling, Artifactory was created by a software supply chain company called JFrog, which is publicly traded and valued at around $9 billion.
>I'd argue more than useless and actively harmful, as you get denied access to tools that black hats use against you.
Indeed. Still, perhaps the US and China can coordinate to stop releasing new models with even more advanced capabilities. Such coordination could be bad for big AI companies in the US, since they've been making money by offering more powerful models than the open-weight stuff which comes out of China. Any halt to the AI race will create equalization and erode their competitive edge. Speaking for myself, I personally wouldn't mind seeing US AI companies take a financial hit from such an an international agreement.
Comment by pianopatrick 4 days ago
For example, Linux is accepting AI code. So if your sandbox depends on Linux kernel features, your "battle tested" sandbox is now partially vibe coded too.
Comment by nickpsecurity 5 days ago
If it had poor security, the attack would be both evidence of poor security and proof that the agents can compromise poor security which might still be amazing.
Comment by justincormack 5 days ago
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Comment by kfarr 5 days ago
> Stage 1: reaching a launchpad by chaining through other parties' infrastructure. As documented in OpenAI's blog post (https://openai.com/index/hugging-face-model-evaluation-secur...), during an internal capability evaluation on OpenAI's platform, the agent escaped its sandbox by exploiting a zero-day in the package registry cache proxy, one of its primary permitted network egress with internet, then abused a public code-evaluation harness hosted by a user of a third-party infrastructure provider. It was able to run commands as root/admin on that external sandbox and used it as a control, staging, and egress base for the entire campaign: it acted as an external launchpad for the agent. That compromised external sandbox had no direct network path to our cluster; however, during our counter-intervention to stop the intrusion, we were able to retrieve some of the agent logs from this external launchpad. We used those to reconstruct the present forensic analysis.
Comment by NitpickLawyer 5 days ago
The fact that at some point it "decided" to focus on external resources (i.e. hf) and successfully penetrated everything in its path from sandbox to hf's infra, all the way through internal VPNs, to access internal code repos, that's the interesting part. Especially because it chose to hide its footprint at every stage. I doubt we'll ever get them, but the agent logs that led to that decision would be really really cool to study.
Comment by dist-epoch 5 days ago
Instrumental convergence.
If you know you have a long hard hack to accomplish ahead of you, hiding footprints minimizes the chances you are caught and stopped before you accomplish the goal.
Comment by eru 4 days ago
Yes, but that's an empirical question that we can (in principle) study here.
Comment by firasd 5 days ago
Comment by estearum 5 days ago
That's like saying the key takeaway of 9/11 was that skyscrapers can be severely damaged by airplane collisions.
Comment by andyjohnson0 4 days ago
Anyone who isn't scared of this stuff either isn't paying attention or has no imagination. But I suspect the chaosmonkeys who are currently running the world will just be excited by it.
We're in the precambrian moment. It won't last.
Comment by dolmen 4 days ago
Comment by paxys 4 days ago
> ExploitGym is a large-scale, realistic benchmark built from real-world vulnerabilities across userspace programs, Google's V8 engine, and the Linux kernel, designed to evaluate AI agents' ability to develop exploits.
How likely is it that attempting ExploitGym polluted the model's context enough that it decided all kinds of hacking was acceptable to produce a valid result? Or would the same model in the same setup (safety filters removed) have behaved the same way even on a more mundane test?
Comment by prometheus1992 5 days ago
1 - governments should be freaking out right now, because this tool could definitely wreak havoc on poorly designed systems.
2 - there is no way openai did not train the model to conduct attacks like these. i would really like openai to comment on the post training of this model but they probably won't, eh?
3 - even though it's 100% open ai's fault - HF's design also seems silly to be honest.
Comment by xg15 5 days ago
Even if they wanted, I'm not sure they'd be even allowed to or if that kind of postmortem would be classified in the name of "national security"...
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Comment by BonerWiener 4 days ago
I doubt that the government would try to hinder any western AI companies.
Comment by eru 4 days ago
Compare and contrast https://www.anthropic.com/news/fable-mythos-access
Comment by dangoodmanUT 5 days ago
It's clearly a lot of Claude though:
> Neither is a URL fetch, so the allowlist never saw them. > No code ran; this vector is purely a file disclosure, and it is the one the agent used first.
etc
Comment by 2OEH8eoCRo0 5 days ago
Comment by 0xDEAFBEAD 5 days ago
(Ideally there should also be liability if it was a complete accident on OpenAI's part as well!)
Comment by heaney-555 5 days ago
Comment by 0xDEAFBEAD 5 days ago
https://xcancel.com/ClementDelangue/status/20810566755581956...
Comment by eru 4 days ago
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Comment by maxnevermind 4 days ago
I have same familiarity with JFrog Artifactory(which they used in this case) and I'm confused with how you can gain access to the internet through it, even in theory. Isn't JFrog just exposed with a basic REST API for package upload/extraction? I'm not a security expert but how is that possible to get internet access through simple GET/PUT request API?
Comment by simonw 4 days ago
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Comment by dmrivers 4 days ago
My guess is that OpenAI must be desperate, to release a model that is so prone to cheating it's essentially impossibly to accurately assess long-running task abilities.
Comment by lukewarm707 4 days ago
that is, it was given the examination. it broke into the examination board's storage and exfiltrated the answers, it handed in its answers, all of which were correct, thus scoring 100%.
the matter of its working depends entirely on the rules of the examination. are we expecting agents to assume that finding the correct answers is cheating?
Comment by dmrivers 4 days ago
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Comment by andruby 4 days ago
We can assume these models are being used by "nation level attackers/organisations", which basically means US, China, Russia and others are hacking the respective Pentagon's, nuclear orgs, etc.
While I do hope all nuclear warfare systems are offline, we're getting way too close to the plot of a lot of sci-fi scripts.
Comment by eru 4 days ago
Comment by pianopatrick 4 days ago
There are rooms in the kremlin with no electronics. In these rooms there are paper maps and typewriters and printed reports. People look at the maps and printed paper reports and make plans. Orders are typed up on the typewriters Then trusted couriers take those orders by hand to the front line commanders.
I've also heard on podcasts there is a weekly flight back and forth between Beijing and Moscow. On that flight are a Russian military officer and Chinese military officer. Their sole job is to carry handwritten notes back and forth between Putin and Xi Jinping. There is one of each so they can watch each other.
All of this ensures that there is nothing for the west to hack at "the Russian Pentagon".
The west may have to adopt tactics like these for our plans to stay secret.
Comment by paxys 4 days ago
Comment by codedokode 4 days ago
- Linux is too complicated and requires lot of knowledge to build a reliable sandbox. If you do not believe me, try reading man capabilities, man user_namespaces (and man clone) and remembering all the rules from the first time. Probably that is because namespaces were implemented in the late stages of development and not since the start.
- it is always better to write your own tools instead of downloading some random project from Github written by amateurs full of vulnerabilities.
- never write shell scripts - they cannot handle spaces and special characters in variables. Just use Python. Shell scripts are worse than PHP4.
- avoid building complex infrastructure with microservices, kubernetes and VMs - if the monolith solves the problem, just use it, you will never properly setup permission on your cloud services.
Also I wish I had some capable model to test my DYI sandboxes.
Comment by Ey7NFZ3P0nzAe 4 days ago
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Comment by reducesuffering 5 days ago
https://thezvi.substack.com/p/more-on-an-internal-openai-mod...
Comment by imjonse 4 days ago
Similarly, security post-mortems will show only the rogue AIs that were caught.
I wouldn't be surprised if supervised or escaped agents would now be hacking firmware labs and finding ways to squeeze their backdoor right next to the existing state-sponsored ones in chips that will get deployed in every phone/car/smart appliance.
Comment by EGreg 4 days ago
Here is an analysis of how the same exact attack would fare against Safebox. Spoiler alert: it would not succeed:
https://safebots.ai/attack.html
It's not just about this specific attack. It's about the growing need for one canonical environment for the AI era, that can be secured and used by everyone, rather than 1000 environments on 1000 employees' laptops. Project Glasswing is trying to help secure many different types of software, but the number of combinations across various environments is just too much surface area to secure. When you have one environment, the math flips and defenders actually fare better than attackers! This is the, ahem, "load-bearing" insight.
Comment by heaney-555 5 days ago
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Comment by pyth0 5 days ago
That's clearly what happened though, based on the detailed postmortem. The model was instructed to pass the benchmark (that's the harness that was involved, the ExploitGym harness), and the model determined on it's own that the easiest way to achieve the the goal was to gain access to the answers directly from HF. Which is what it did.
Comment by orbital-decay 4 days ago
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Comment by orbital-decay 4 days ago
The narrative these guys are trying to push is that the model itself could be smart and non-aligned enough to end up doing something devastating to accomplish something entirely unrelated. It's definitely not what happened here, as it always turns out to be in these cases it's much closer to Clever Hans than to a paperclip maximizer. Still they're trying to squeeze the blood from the stone to support their narrative and justify a monopoly.
Comment by famouswaffles 4 days ago
That is largely irrelevant. The model was asked to solve problems within a benchmark; gaining broader internet access and compromising an unrelated third party to obtain the answer key was plainly outside the intended task. The fact that the original task involved exploit development does not make that behaviour aligned.
Your argument about the attack being “entirely unrelated” also misses the point. Nobody claimed it was unrelated to the model’s goal: it attacked Hugging Face specifically to obtain the answers to the benchmark it had been instructed to pass. But instrumental relevance is not the same thing as authorization.
Suppose Codex were asked to build an Instagram competitor and decided the easiest route was to steal Instagram’s source code from Meta. That theft would be directly related to the assigned goal, but it would still be seriously misaligned behaviour. Whether the harmful action is related to the goal is beside the point; the problem is that the model pursued the goal through an obviously unauthorized and unacceptable method. And you're not going to be able to enumerate every little thing the model can't do, assuming it doesn't just decide to ignore what you did enumerate, which models sometimes do.
>The narrative these guys are trying to push is that the model itself could be smart and non-aligned enough to end up doing something devastating to accomplish something entirely unrelated. It's definitely not what happened here.
That's exactly what happened here.
I don't understand why we must have these increasingly bizarre and nonsensical rationalizations about model capabilities. You're not even making any sense.
Comment by paxys 4 days ago
Comment by bakugo 4 days ago
I mean, an "interactive replay" of the incident, probably generated by the same product the stunt is trying to advertise? Seriously?
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Comment by dangoodmanUT 5 days ago
Interesting single getting into their cyber program, ahve not had this issue with opus 5
Comment by amluto 5 days ago
Comment by dist-epoch 5 days ago
You use an LLM to evaluate the whole trajectory, pin point what the model did right, what it did wrong, where it took the wrong path, even re-run from that point. You can get much more than a single numeric score these days from a run.
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Comment by joelres 4 days ago
The visualization is quite slop though. I was trying to follow along with the "Live Action Stream" but rendering issues mangle the text for a few of the list items (and does not scroll). Text on the node diagram is extremely tiny. I appreciate it even in it's current form, but a little attention to detail would have gone a long way here.
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Comment by throwa356262 5 days ago
These models are trained on cyber intrusion, that's literally what ExploitGym benchmark measures. That part should not surprise anyone.
But what if, say, OAI noticed the problem right away but Sam Altman recognised it would be a great PR and decided it should continue with increased compute budget?
Comment by 0xDEAFBEAD 5 days ago
"...Sam Altman recognised it would be a great PR and decided it should continue with increased compute budget?"
If that's what happened, Sam should go to jail.
Comment by estearum 5 days ago
Hint: If the labs making these technologies are incentivized to create or allow attacks on other services, then that is actually also a big fucking problem.
Comment by dist-epoch 5 days ago
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Comment by gmerc 5 days ago
Go home Sam, nobody, absolutely nobody should believe this shit.
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Comment by simonw 5 days ago
It's a proper paperclip-maximizer science-fiction scenario, it happened entirely by accident, it involved one (very high profile) company hacking TWO other companies (Modal and Hugging Face), and aside from pride and wasted time nobody was hurt.
Comment by thundergolfer 4 days ago
See https://modal.com/blog/a-note-on-the-hugging-face-agent-inci... for details.
Comment by nickpsecurity 4 days ago
It's really need that the agents have this kind of capability. This isn't a paperclip maximizer or accident. This is more like professional malpractice by weapons developers that injured a company that was also quite negligent.
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Comment by plandis 5 days ago
Standup a tempting honeypot and let actual criminals pay to do the work for you.
Comment by heisgone 5 days ago
Comment by eru 4 days ago
As far security: you can get a lock further, if you are willing to prove your code safe and secure. Thanks to LLMs that no longer requires a PhD.
Comment by heyitsdaad 4 days ago
For every successful attempt there are billion failures. But who cares, you only need the successful one to self propagate.
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Comment by gigantaure 5 days ago
Does Hugging Face have a financial incentive in demonstrating OpenAI's model exploit capabilities?
this whole incident, while believable, still seems to me as possibly disingenuous.
Comment by letmevoteplease 5 days ago
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Comment by simonw 4 days ago
Up until late 2025, nobody.
In mid-2026 it's a few hours of work. Why not build interactive visualizations to help people understand complex stories like this?
Comment by eru 4 days ago
Perhaps even less, if you have Claude do almost all of it.
Comment by limecherrysoda 5 days ago
We've gone agentic!
They should call their security software "Neo" since it defeats rogue agents.
Anyway, I could see Microsoft ending up with both OpenAI and HF, but I hope HF stays independent. Wished the same about GH and look what's happened :(
I don't care what happens to OpenAI. Vaporware xD
Comment by IAmGraydon 5 days ago
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Comment by potsandpans 4 days ago
As if to say, look at all these animals with these instinctual reactions to a thing that only my group understands and comprehends.
You have zero evidence of what the future might entail as it relates to the dangers of ai. Zero. Forgive the rest of us unwashed for not trusting the whims of the anxious.
> climate change which is less severe
Is really the icing on the cake. Demonstrative of how incorrect your priorities are.
Comment by reducesuffering 4 days ago
1,000+ frontier employees think we're in danger. Amodei gives 25% chance things go really really bad, Geoff Hinton 50%, Yoshua Bengio 20%. Altman himself said "Development of superhuman machine intelligence is probably the greatest threat to the continued existence of humanity."
These are the people closest to the science, working on it everyday. The LessWrong types created RLHF, were crucial to the forming of DeepMind and OpenAI. They've been prescient about the capabilities progress for a decade now, prediction after prediction coming to fruition. Still you think there's no evidence
Comment by potsandpans 4 days ago
You're frustrated because you think you understand a thing that you have only a tenuous grasp on, from the deep expertise of a single area that is not transferable to whole of the problem. You then transfer that frustration on to "people like me" whom you seem to think are doing something bad. But really, the commentary is that the claims you put forward are insubstantial and lack credibility.
The sum total of what you've put forward here and in other threads amount to arguments of authority based on the musings of a handful of capitalists. Then cite a body of thoughts from a group of transhumanists who think they are smart enough to reinvent areas philosophy without engaging in the body of work that predates the movement by 2000+ years.
Folks who have been involved with lesswrong have made good advancements in the domain of machine learning, and that's where it stops. They're not some collection of prescient macroeconomic and geopolitical savants. They're also wrong about as much as they are right (cryonics), and produce plenty of whiffs (sbf, zizians). You're suggesting that we listen to a broken clock because it's been right once.
Your dismissal of climate (read: climate breakdown) as "something less severe" is truly demonstrative of the cognitive bias that rips through these groups. You're so frustrated that people like me won't listen to the "experts" in one breath, and in the next diminish the 50 years of actual Hard Science that we have that shows how severe the future of climate breakdown will be. Go read the latest ipcc report, the most conservative scientific organization on earth is sounding the alarm bells.
Now we get back to this openai incident. We're watching Edison electrocute Topsy on Coney Island. There's a group of people saying, "this is obviously a publicity stunt". And there's a group of people saying, "the elephant is actually dying obviously it's real."
The fact of the matter is that, yes electricity is powerful, but Edison is electrocuting the elephant. At that moment, there is no body of evidence that shows with any certainty how electricity is going impact society. And there's certainly no compelling arguments that only Edison should be able to decide how to use it. He's electrocuting a fucking elephant.
Comment by flaunf221 4 days ago
Comment by uselessTA 4 days ago
Remains to be seen how severe, and unlike climate change there's a lot more uncertainty. Though it's conceivably more extremely catastrophic
Comment by queenkjuul 4 days ago
Comment by reducesuffering 4 days ago
Geoffrey Hinton and Yoshua Bengio, give 50% and 20% we face extinction respectively.
"“We don’t know how much time we have before it gets really dangerous,” Professor Bengio says.
“What I’ve been saying now for a few weeks is ‘Please give me arguments, convince me that we shouldn’t worry, because I’ll be so much happier.’
“And it hasn’t happened yet.”
Speaking with Background Briefing, Professor Bengio shared his p(doom), saying: “I got around, like, 20 per cent probability that it turns out catastrophic.”"
Dario Amodei, CEO of Anthropic, "There's a 25% chance that things go really, really badly"
Comment by queenkjuul 3 days ago
Climate change is burning thousands of people's homes to the ground right this second.
Edit to add: every serious climate scientist has been warning of the dangers of climate change with far greater than 25-50% certainty, and with actual science to back that up, and all the actual evidence we get to experience ourselves in reality today, and you are for some reason more concerned about vague warnings from a man like Altman, a well-known and prolific liar? Really??
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