Python 3.14 garbage collection rigamarole

Maybe in all those years they could have thought of that.

a) do work to reduce issues as they come up b) appease the vocal complaints

A takes work, guts, and risk. Option b was chosen with the GC work basically saddled with so much process it’s never going to change. Python has a very storied history of being very committee driven design so the committee did the committee thing.

Hi, I'm a pip maintainer, can you please report any issue you think is happening in recent versions of pip: https://github.com/pypa/pip/

I particularly work on performance and stability and think we've been making big strides over the last two years

> getting everyone to install private venv's for every app, leading to missing security updates, because updates just break everything.

venv's stop your OS tooling from breaking, Linux distro maintainers pushed Python packaging to not allow installing into the system packages by default, and they weren't wrong.

All these other problems are solved with proper use of a lock file (which are now standardized, and you can generate and install from them in the latest version of pip), and/or use a project tool (uv, poetry, etc.).

3.14 broke GC

I guess these kinds of priorities are exactly why Python is not my favorite programming language and why you have tens of Python versions installed on any machine. Not to talk about the Python 2 -> 3 drama that was also about fetishising syntax and pureness over pragmatism, installed base, and respect for existing code.

Even if you dislike the direction Python is going in, a lot of what attracted people to Python in the first place is still there. The readability, the large standard library, the huge ecosystem. There are libraries and frameworks for everything: numerical stuff, web development, GUIs etc. Its actually a nice language in itself, just going in the wrong direction now.

If you look at it historically it was really good comparatively. If you compare it to the alternatives available 20 years ago it looks pretty good.

Because of the libraries, not necessarily the language, which is also quite straightforward. For example we found a niche library that speaks the ISO-TP protocol in Python, which allows us to communicate with vehicle ECUs. That's why people also use C++, even tough I quite doubt it's because they like the language. Add to that that it's also heavily used in embedded programming. Yes, you could call a C/C++ library from another language, depending how well the language can do that.

I prefer Ruby, but Python probably has just about everything one would need. It's also great for data processing. We hardly have anything better than pandas, polars, numpy, scipy in other languages and that:s without even mentioning ML tooling.

Packaging can be irritating although uv takes the sting out a bit.

You are right that outside of verbosity, once you get used to the syntax of a language, the value of one over the other kind of fades.

They are as standard as arguing about Ant, Maven, Gradle in Java, npm, pnpm, yarn in node, and so on.

However I fully agree with the gist of your comment, basically Python is the new BASIC.

However at least BASIC was compiled, with exception of the 8 bit home micros.

Take list comprehensions for example. It is mostly syntax: you can do virtually all list comprehensions with just a map and filter function. But the way that it is integrated and presents the code, makes is vastly easier to follow for most developers, which tilts the balancer in favor of doing away with loops and mutable state. Is it syntax that made them do so? Yes, maybe. But its the actual semantics that provide the value.

Syntax really does matter more than you give it credit for. Were that not the case, I'd expect one Lisp or Scheme dialect or other to take Python's place. Outside of that counterfactual, Python's competition was stuff like Ruby, and it turned out that network effects were also pretty important.