Tell HN: iCloud with Advanced Data Protection doesn't delete your files

Posted by mnls 6 hours ago

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I discovered something concerning about iCloud's Advanced Data Protection (ADP) that Apple doesn't disclose: deleted files are never actually removed from their servers. The Test: I have a 5 Mbit/sec upload connection. I copied 6GB of my personal files (music, videos, photos) to iCloud Drive. They "uploaded" in 15 minutes— which is impossible at my bandwidth. The files were previously uploaded a long ago and deleted since. To verify, I checked Activity Monitor: only 3.42GB total data sent since boot, including web browsing. The 6GB upload never happened.

Confirmation Test: Created a 100MB file with random data: dd if=/dev/urandom of=randomfile.dat bs=1m count=100 Uploaded to iCloud: took 2-3 minutes, Activity Monitor showed 122MB sent (correct) Deleted the file from iCloud Drive "Permanently deleted" from Recently Deleted and emptied any files from Data recovery. Re-uploaded the identical file: completed in 1 second Activity Monitor: essentially zero data sent

Apple kept the encrypted blocks even after "permanent deletion."

The month-long test (in progress): I'm keeping the random file and will attempt to re-upload it after 30+ days to see if Apple purges data on any schedule, or retains it indefinitely.

Why this matters: ADP is marketed as giving users exclusive control over their data "Delete" and "Permanent Delete" options imply data removal Upload progress bars show fake "uploading" status for deduplication operations Users cannot verify what data Apple retains. To attempt permanent deletion, you must disable ADP web access

What's unclear: Does this apply to Health data, Passwords, and other ADP-protected content? How long does Apple retain "deleted" encrypted blocks? Can users ever truly remove their data?

I'm not claiming the encryption is weak—it's probably fine. But Apple's lack of transparency about data retention and deduplication with ADP is concerning. "Permanent delete" should mean permanent delete. Has anyone else noticed this behavior? I'll update this post after completing the 30-day retention test.

Comments

Comment by sillyblob67 4 hours ago

I recently discovered this as well. A bit unnerving. I now use Cryptomator (because key destruction matters).

Comment by plasticsoprano 6 hours ago

I mean, you didn’t give it enough time. All of these cloud storage platforms are databases at their core. When you delete the file you’re updating the database entry, the data (and the record of it) is still there until their purge process runs, which could be days or weeks.

If it’s still there at a month I’d be surprised and be checking terms of service to see what they commit to.

Comment by dangus 6 hours ago

I think it may be as long as 180 days, but I haven’t found anything super specific from Apple.

Remember that Apple’s typical customer is non-technical. Keeping files in case of a catastrophic deletion is safer for their customers.

They want to give the person who calls them up and says “I deleted all my family photos 31 days ago!” A good experience.